Weight & Balance worksheet for PA22-150/160

[moto657]

So, why isn't anybody commenting? Do all of you ignore your weight and balance like I did? How many of you have weighed your planes in the last 3 or 4 years or so. 2020 was when ADSB became a mandate. 65 year old planes....I think you're all fat and don't want to admit it. Porky, porky, porky fat. Everybody just sort of within bounds and hoping for the best?? Come on, I want to know some real empty weights. I showed you mine...

My PA22/20 is 1155.7lbs without the rear seat(-23lbs). It was weighed (with and without the rear seat) in 2013 when it had some work done and the fuse recovered. It was 1210 then, I’ve been whittling it down over the last couple years. My final goal is less than 1100.

[Steve Pierce]

Having reweighed several rag and tube Pipers I have a hard time believing the original empty weights. A friend who modifies Cessna 182s says you never reweigh a Cessna cause you limit your useful load.

[Subsonic]

My PA22/20 is 1155.7lbs without the rear seat(-23lbs). It was weighed (with and without the rear seat) in 2013 when it had some work done and the fuse recovered. It was 1210 then, I’ve been whittling it down over the last couple years. My final goal is less than 1100.

How did you get it down to 1178.7 from 1210? Just the fuse recover?

[moto657]

How did you get it down to 1178.7 from 1210? Just the fuse recover?

No. 1210 was the weight after the recover.

The weight loss was from:
1. -6.9lb ERZ 8012 starter.
2. -17.9lb Remove wheel pants/hardware and change 6.00 6 ply tires to Desser smooth 8.50s.
3. -5.5lb Removed Apollo 2001/360 Map GPS units and wiring.
4. -1.0lb Replaced Interav VR, OVR, and capacitor with Plane Power voltage reg and cleaned up the wiring.

[tnowak]

I didn't realise that Ceconite with a butyrate finish could weigh that much more than the original cotton and dope that Piper used.
I think I have accounted for every single thing different on my PA17 Vagabond compared to when it left the factory.
Still can't account for about 30 lb....
I think Piper used special weighing scales!
TonyN

[dgapilot]

I didn't realise that Ceconite with a butyrate finish could weigh that much more than the original cotton and dope that Piper used.
I think I have accounted for every single thing different on my PA17 Vagabond compared to when it left the factory.
Still can't account for about 30 lb....
I think Piper used special weighing scales!
TonyN

If you figure that most people use about double the tapes that Piper used and Piper only put about 8 coats of dope it’s easy to see how a job that uses 2 or 3 extra rolls of 2” or 3” tapes and 20 coats of dope to fill the weave will weigh 30 lbs more.


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[mholton63]

All -
Why is it that almost every W&B sheet I see has the arm adjusted to the W.L.E. (wings leading edge) rather than leaving it from the original datum point? When I use the W.L.E. sheet, I show out of W&B much lighter than I should be. I'm not sure why. I've checked the math and calculations several time. When I use the original Datum point I can load another 60 pounds.

[Gilbert Pierce]

The wing leading edge is the datum point on my airplane according to the original W&B.
Piper used 60” in front of the wing leading edge in some documents. I guess to make the math easier for people not used to working with negative numbers. They then subtracted 60” from all the numbers to arrive at the CG.
Using the WLE as datum, the Arm in front of the leading edge is negative and aft of the leading edge is positive.
Then you after add positive and negative numbers to arrive at the CG.
Using either of the above methods you arrive at the same CG.

[dgapilot]

All -
Why is it that almost every W&B sheet I see has the arm adjusted to the W.L.E. (wings leading edge) rather than leaving it from the original datum point? When I use the W.L.E. sheet, I show out of W&B much lighter than I should be. I'm not sure why. I've checked the math and calculations several time. When I use the original Datum point I can load another 60 pounds.

If you are doing it correctly they should both be the same. Doesn't really matter where you put the datum as long as all moments are calculated using the SAME datum. What screws up a lot of folks is that they will mix up the datums, some will be based on the leading edge and others will be based on 60" in front of the leading edge. I find it best to go to the TCDS and use the arm published in the TCDS. If there isn't an arm listed, then level the airplane, drop a plumb bob and mark the floor with chalk at the leading edge and the location in question and take a tape measure.

[NormF]

I've been working on a spreadsheet to facilitate the W&B of my 58 PA-22-160. If anyone would like to critique my Weight & Balance Spreadsheet, I'd be glad to share it. Just shoot me an email @ norman.fillion@gmail.com