0 time to short wing pilot

[RTH]

I'm new to the short wing piper. My buddy just bought a Piper colt tailwheel with 150hp Lycoming. I am suppose to teach him to fly it, he has no prior experience. I'm a low time CFI with 4-500 hours tailwheel time but none as instructor or in a colt. I made a few landings with it and bounced every one. I guess I need more practice myself. Any advice or information would be welcome.

[Stephen]

Yes practice.

Search approach speeds, you will lots of discussion.

Use 80 mph on long approach. Cut to 70 on final and find the best speed and power combination that works for you.

[pa20]

RTH...Welcome to SWPO, and to the world of SWP's! With 400+ hr of T/W time, the Colt should not be a huge challenge for you. I guess I will begin by asking you what difficulties you are encountering? You said you "bounced every one" of the landings you made. Did you float after the bounce, or did it settle right back on? What speeds are you using for your approaches? Are you trimmed to pretty much neutral as you go into the flare?
Lets start with the basics, and work our way through this.

Yes practice.

Search approach speeds, you will lots of discussion.

Use 80 mph on long approach. Cut to 70 on final and find the best speed and power combination that works for you.

Good starting point! The question that I should have asked above is this....Have you done stalls to glean the Vs speeds for this particular Colt? Colt, Pacer, spam can, or 747, this is need to know info!

[Gilbert Pierce]

Always three point a Short Wing when starting out. Even in a cross wind.
After you get some experience then experiment with wheel landings.

[andya]

I try to be stabilize at least 1/2 mile on final looking for 1.3 or a mph or 2 less at the point I pull the power back approaching the flare.
For me this is usually a power on approach with about a 3 deg glide slope. If you want to do full power off the last half mile or more
you will obviously have a steeper glide path and higher descent rate and will require good timing to start the flare so you don't run out
of airspeed to high above the runway.

Due to airspeed indicator and system errors between airplanes, I do a stall series to find the correct number for my airplane
for both no flap and full flap configuration.

[pa20]

....snipped...
Due to airspeed indicator and system errors between airplanes, I do a stall series to find the correct number for my airplane
for both no flap and full flap configuration.

Since he has a Colt, he has a lot less testing to do! Spot on with the 1.3 on final. I maintain that speed until close in, cross the "numbers" at about 1.2, and continue to bleed speed to about 1.1 at the flare.
Gilbert's statement above is identical to how I learned to fly my Pacer. With stiff bungees and 6.00x6 tires there is a greater propensity to get a bounce in a wheel landing. So, they are best approached with a certain amount of prior knowledge of the planes characteristics.

[tloes]

This is not a tailwheel-specific comment but rather an overall "shortwing" comment.

If you are used to flying Cessnas or maybe Cherokees or any other plane that floats (or at least glides at a shallow slope), you ought to make your final approach with some power on (at least 1200 rpm, maybe up to 1500 rpm). It will make the glideslope more like "other planes" and the extra airflow over the tail will prevent "plopping" due to a loss of elevator authority.

If you are experienced flying bricks, "nevermind".

Best regards,

Todd

[Gilbert Pierce]

What Todd said.
I carry a little power usually all the way to the wheels brushing the tops of the grass. Other wise your butt might signal you the bottom is about to drop out and if I don't my wife is quick to tell me "you dropped it in again". Float on final is not a characteristic of these airplanes.

[Tp109]

He did not mention wether or not this colt has Ferguson Plane Booster wing tips, they really increase lift and you dont have the sink like a brick feeling when power off. Slow down and go down is not easy with Ferguson Plane Booster tips.

Ths article written by a Tri Pacer owner talks about the difference he experienced after installing them, I cant say anything regarding the better xwind control, I havent flown a SWP without Ferguson tips, I can say I like how my plane flys with them.

http://www.aviationconsumer.com/lett...bileView=false
"In your discussion of mods for the Piper Tripacer (PA 22-150), you did not mention what I found to be the best of them, the Plane Booster "droopy" wing tips that I purchased and had installed. My airplane, a 1956 model Tripacer with these tips, is pictured in James Ellis' book, Buying and Owning Your Own Airplane.

As advertised, the droopy tips greatly improved short field takeoffs and low speed controllability and they reduced the Tripacer's famed power-off, brick-like sink rate.

One thing not mentioned in the Plane Booster's advertisements is that the tips improved crosswind handling because of the increase in aileron control. Another advantage, because of the improved low-speed controllability, is that in a power-off stall and with the wheel way back, the airplane merely would sink, with no drop-off of either wing."

[RTH]

Thanks everybody for your comments . I haven't got to fly the plane much as we have been working on it. Hot rear cylinders so we are doing the SB 258 to see if that will help. This plane has nether droop tips or VGs. Comments on either are welcome. When I get it going I will go do some stalls to establish what speed to use on final. I was using 75 then 70. Both seemed fast but without doing any stalls I didn't know what to expect. Without power the descent rate was fast.