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I went to the FAA building at OSH and saw all their nice displays. I stopped at the ADSB display and was looking at their nice brochures. A nice FAA lady walks over and asks can I help you? I says yea, I'm an old Piper guy, if it was made in Lock Haven I'm in, Florida not so much. How come the homebuilts can equip with non TSO a lot cheaper and go fly in the same airspace as me and I have to spend more for TSO just because 57 years ago my plane was built in a factory? Aren't you receiving the same ADSB out signal either way? Well she got a real puzzled look and said that's a good question and she'd have to write it down for when she got back to where ever she came from. She passed me off to another fellow who basically said the same thing and that EAA was working on advancing technology into the older planes such as their Dynon STC. Fortunately I fly in D, E andG airspace and hardly ever go into C so I can wait and see what else comes up. So far I like the wing tip light idea but it seems I heard of some one else working on the same thing but mounted in an inspection hole or something.
Attached is a letter I faxed to the Los Angeles ACO. Don't know what it will accomplish, but at least there will be a description on the table as to what the issues are.
Let's say you are under the Bravo umbrella but can stay under the controlled airspace... are Mode C and ADSB out still required under the regs?
Not necessarily. You could be under the Class B airspace but within the 30 mile mode C veil.
If you operate in airspace that currently requires a Mode C or Mode S transponder,
in 2020, that same airspace will require ADSB-Out.
Not necessarily. You could be under the Class B airspace but within the 30 mile mode C veil.
If you operate in airspace that currently requires a Mode C or Mode S transponder,
in 2020, that same airspace will require ADSB-Out.
Homer, doesn't all class B airspace have the thirty mile Mode C Vail? Which I believe starts at the ground, requiring a C or S transponder.
To my surprise, I got a call from the Los Angeles ACO regarding my letter (see previous item in this thread). A gentleman named Jerry Ramos called to discuss the content.
He said he was not in the area that would have actions for this but he would move it along to where it needed to go. ( OK, knock it off I know what you are thinking and
saying, just read on. . He at first thought I was saying that 91.225 and 91.227 DID exempt Experimental and LSA from ADSB-OUT. He said "I don't see
anywhere that it exempts them !" To that I absolutely rejoiced and said to him. "You are misunderstanding me, I have for years been saying what you just agreed to,
THANK YOU SIR !
From that we moved on. I related to him that my field approval for installation of a Non Full TSO C-166b compliant BUT Operational Requirements compliant to the
TSO C-166b (Per 91.225 and 91.227) ADSB-Out UART was disapproved by the FSDO. To shorten up about a half hour conversation where he was explaining the process
of getting data approved, and if I disagreed with my rejection that possibly going to the FSDO manager and discussing it might resolve issues. Now comes the meat
and potatoes of our conversation. I informed him that the FSDO did not review anything because they pulled out FAA Order 8900.362 which said the UART has to be
full TSO C-166b approved. That was the first statement in the Order, so they pretty much said to not let the door hit me you know where on the way out. Mr. Ramos
and I discussed that a bit and basically there was admission that there was conflict between part 91 documents and the FAA Order, but resolution of the issues with
the FAA order was not an area he was involved in. Anyway, as things died down, he asked again about what the FAA order number was, and he pulled it up, and now
the fun begins. FAA Order 8900.362 was CANCELLED May 9 of this year. Anyway, he wanted me to send him something that detailed in print that the FAA publicly
said 91.225 and 91.227 Final rule was intended to exempt Experimental and LSA, so I did that, and finally asked him where he thinks I stand on the issue of the
8900.362 being the stake in the heart on my Field approval but it has now been Cancelled. He interestingly enough said that maybe I should re-submit my Field approval.
So, he wants to still continue some dialog on this, I thanked him for his call and that was the end.
Homer, doesn't all class B airspace have the thirty mile Mode C Vail? Which I believe starts at the ground, requiring a C or S transponder.
Yes they do but if you look at a TAC chart you see that there are areas of the Class B that start at an altitude that below the altitude is not in the Class B
but is inside the Mode C Veil, and some areas that are not even close to the beginning of the Class B but are in the Mode C Veil. So you are not in the Class B,
but are in the Mode C Veil, and as such a Mode C transponder is required.
Last edited by Homer Landreth; 08-09-2017 at 11:22 AM.
Yes they do but if you look at a TAC chart you see that there are areas of the Class B that start at an altitude that below the altitude is not in the Class B
but is inside the Mode C Veil, and some areas that are not even close to the beginning of the Class B but are in the Mode C Veil. So you are not in the Class B,
but are in the Mode C Veil, and as such a Mode C transponder is required.
"You are misunderstanding me, I have for years been saying what you just agreed to,
THANK YOU SIR !
I suggest we bring this inequality to the attention of Senator James Mountain Inhofe who authored and ushered through the PBOR-2 legislation for FAA medical reform.
Do we have any Oklahoma residents on this Forum willing to draft a letter?
Thanks: 
Likes: Originally Posted by Frank Green
Re: uAvionix's Low-Cost ADS-B Out
. He at first thought I was saying that 91.225 and 91.227 DID exempt Experimental and LSA from ADSB-OUT. He said "I don't see
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