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Thread: Not another stretched pacer question.....

  1. #11

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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    Stretched mine 23". Hammered my wing ribs from .025 2024 t3. 2 hours per rib.

  2. #12
    Stephen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Txtaildragger View Post
    Since my computer skills are lacking for putting current project pictures on the thread I have a wing question.........Is wing loading the determining factor for choosing the total wing length.........or is it just that darn hangar door width?
    Building a plane that does not fit into it's space is not a good idea.

    Wing surface area (thus wing loading) has a big effect on performance. I stared out 35 years ago with a 29 foot wing span Tri Pacer with Madras tips. Then I spliced the spars going to a 33 foot wing span under the Ferguson wing. The plane had a lower stall and approach speed but little change in cruise. It flew like a Pacer. All good. Now I have a 37 foot wing span with the Bushmaster mod and I have an even low stall and approach but I lost some cruise speed. Other differences are less measurable. The plane flys at much lower RPM's but, remains on the step for cruise. It flys like a Cub, only faster. So increasing wing span and adding SA has significant effects. Cruise speeds, stall speed and basic flying characteristics. Some are tradeoffs.
    "You can only tie the record for flying low."

  3. #13
    Stephen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Don D View Post
    Stretched mine 23". Hammered my wing ribs from .025 2024 t3. 2 hours per rib.
    Any picters of your rib work?
    "You can only tie the record for flying low."

  4. #14

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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    Hammered your own ribs? Thats really neat, Id sure like to see a pic of those…….As for the wing length, I appreciate the explanation provided. Im stretching out to 25". I have no facts to back up why I'm using a 25" extension. Kinda figured after everything is said and done if needed Ill adjust the CG by adding inches to the engine mount, although i kinda think the controllable pitch weight may allow me with just using a zero thrust Maule mount……………..Just thinking out loud here.
    Stretched Pacer Project E/AB
    A&P / EAA#11681 (legacy number from my great uncle)

  5. #15

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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    Flanging lightning holes is the hardest part. 23" is perfect stretch. Use the TLAR method. You can get Carlson extrusions and build truss type ribs which is what I would do if we're to build another plane. Sorry my pic's were before digital. Get Tony Bengillis books. They explain how to really build airplanes.

  6. #16

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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    Roger thar Don! I'll check out his books.
    Stretched Pacer Project E/AB
    A&P / EAA#11681 (legacy number from my great uncle)

  7. #17
    Southern Aero's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Txtaildragger View Post
    Hammered your own ribs? Thats really neat, Id sure like to see a pic of those…….As for the wing length, I appreciate the explanation provided. Im stretching out to 25". I have no facts to back up why I'm using a 25" extension. Kinda figured after everything is said and done if needed Ill adjust the CG by adding inches to the engine mount, although i kinda think the controllable pitch weight may allow me with just using a zero thrust Maule mount……………..Just thinking out loud here.
    TX

    Another option is to modify the original mount to a zero down thrust (take out the 3.75 degrees down) but leave the right thrust in it. OR you will need more fin offset or some form of rudder trim. Your choice of 25" is close enuff to bring your project in line with the other Piper long wing fuselage lengths...... which is the whole idea anyway. I used 24". I have heard of everything from 22 to 36. Obviously the longer you extend aft the more you must compensate forward. If you go with a constant speed prop you may be close in your balance issue. Unless you follow a previous conversion exactly, best way might be to save your engine mount to last and adjust length accordingly. With so many changes that can be made in the conversion it can be hard to calculate CG. I would suggest to adjust mount to most adverse forward CG condition of low fuel, single pilot and no cargo. FWIW

  8. #18

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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    I hear what your saying about the engine mount stuff...... Only thing is I'm going to be running a 360. Like you said, it's something I'll have to deal with when it's time weight the bird and modify accordingly. As far as the zero thrust, we'll I figured I'd build in a trim tab for the rudder.........the whole rudder offset modification or getting the precise engine mount angles has me scratching my head with building a jig.
    Stretched Pacer Project E/AB
    A&P / EAA#11681 (legacy number from my great uncle)

  9. #19
    Gilbert Pierce's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    Look at Steve's Aircraft rudder trim system.

  10. #20
    Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Default Re: Not another stretched pacer question.....

    So what is zeroing the thrusting going to do with the angle of incidence on a Pacer?

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