Banned

[Frank Green]

How come I'm not allowed to look at the interior question?

[Steve Pierce]

It was posted in the members section. I have several technical articles in the works that will also be posted there after Oshkosh.

[JohnW]

You're posting TECHNICAL ARTICLES in the Member's Only Section??? Why don't you just retain the "paid seats" for the GOB crapola that you don't want said in the Public Domain, the Secret Squirrel Stuff? Appreciation for what is available through (and FROM) contribution would seem like what prompts the desire in a "User" to assist in upkeep and availability. This smacks of "commercialism" a bit, seems like. Is that where this is going, SELLING information of interest? Just trying to clarify, because I know for a fact anything I have ever "offered" (for what it may or may not be worth) didn't PAY ME a penny for the "trouble" of taking the time to write it, and I'm not interested in that game anyway.
Inevitably, you will wind up with the same questions in the "free area" and a "private club" in the other. Eh, maybe that's how you WANT it! How exactly does this work??? Is there a Not-For-Profit at work here? 'cause, at least the SWPC IS one. When do I get to see a copy of the Yearly Financial Report (or, where do I request it)?

[Gilbert Pierce]

Guess what folks?

IT COSTS MONEY TO RUN A WEB SITE. You gotta pay for the equipment and data lines-it ain't free. If there is no incentive to contribute then no one will contribute and the site shuts down. Real simple economics at play here.

The cost to run the Short Wing Piper Club site comes out of your dues. If you are NOT a member then certain parts of that site are also restricted.

[Steve Pierce]

I understand exactly what you are saying John. It will be posted in the public domain first and then later archived in the members area. I don't care to make any money on this endeavor (shortwingpipers.org). I just want it to be self supporting. I spend a lot of time as you do, giving away what i have learned. I was given a lot of what I know for free and through the school of hard knocks. I enjoy passing that on and learning from the others here. I am trying to build a first class website with limited funds and time. I am also competing with the SWPC who has unlimited funds. I was asked by the SWPC president if I would consider merging the two sites. I told him I was not interested. Probably because I am still bitter about why this site got started and everything that was done several years ago to get the SWPC to move in this direction that was not done. I think there are people in place that will move the SWPC forward if others will let them. I on the other hand would rather be able to have the freedom to help build this site and let it stand on it's own merits rather than have to answer to a large committee that doesn't use the Internet. I hope you understand where I am coming from.

John W,

Certainly we have kept no secret about the fact that ShortWingPipers.Org is a privately held company, and your post does merit an "about us" link that makes it clear how we operate. There is a corporation formed around SWPO, and the intent is to provide general free web based information for those seeking it, as well as provide a richer content area for those willing to pay a little something for the incredible amount of time it takes to assemble and manage the information. We are not affiliated in any way with the SWPC, and while the corporation is not a not-for-profit, I can guarantee you that it is non-profit! :shock: Even as the site grows we expect it will be a number of years before it begins to break even.

If members or others want to make contributions to be held in the on-line library we are working on, they are certainly willing to do so, by the same token nothing will go in there that we do not have permission from the creator to use. By your tone, it sounds as though you are concerned about your intellectual property being marginalized, and certainly that is not the case - nor our intention. People are perfectly welcome to share any information they like in the non-members area (as long as it suits our code of conduct for language, content, etc) and it will remain in those areas.

There will ALWAYS be areas of this site - in fact the lion's share of it - that will be free to those like yourself who may not be interested in supporting the work that goes into it. We will continue to operate similar to public television in that regard - getting support from those who lend it, which will no doubt include advertisers at some point.

To reiterate what Steve said, at the time of creating this site, the SWPC seemed to have NO interest in properly maintaining and developing their web presence and seemed to be only interested in the world of print. With the international appreciation of these planes growing, there is a whole audience of folks who can take advantage of the information from anywhere in the world, and we wanted to give them the opportunity to do so in a way that can support itself, and not just be another labor of love that goes away when some guy gets tired of doing it from his basement.

I appreciate your concerns, although not particularly the adversarial manner in which they were expressed. We do need to be very clear about who we are, what are motives are (which I think are very clear to most people) and how we collect funds to keep this site going.

Thanks

sj

[Curly]

Sorry JW - I normally agree with everything you write, but I think you are wrong on this one.

The SWPC site is free (provided you are a member) but as I have said in another place - the troglodytes who run the SWPC have indicated quite clearly,
(and a few of them in nasty, mean spirited terms) that given a choice, "they would vote to close the site down".

I wish Homer and Frank S every success in what they are trying to do on the SWPC site. And I will do whatever a SWPC member needs to do, to help them.
However - until there is a change of attitude at the top, I think they are pushing a marble up a hill with a pencil!
As an example, you only have to look at the total lack of reporting of the Cable conference - no report, no winners, no pictures, no diddly squat!

Curly.

[rmalone]

Having some idea as to how much time and effort Steve Pierce and Steve Johnson have invested in this site would make one wonder why they go to the trouble at times. Personally I find this source of information invaluable while rebuilding my Pacer. Finding people like this that are willing to share information as Steve does is a lucky break for me. If you can afford one of these aircraft, you can afford the small membership fee.

Aside from that look at all of the great people and personalities this site brings together

[Bultaco Jim]

I agree with Rex completely, and would like to point out how Steve P. doesn't just answer a question, but often goes the extra step of adding the website that's needed, or, a digital photo. It's appreciated Steve.

[Stephen]

The small amount asked to help pay for expenses of this site does not come close to the value of the information that is received.