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Thread: Tiedowns

  1. #1
    Frank Green's Avatar
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    Default Tiedowns

    Just curious of you lucky ones that went to SNF and survived. Did you notice which temporary tiedowns worked and more important which didn't. I made up a set which I carry all the time in the cargo compartment which is 3 - 6" round 1/8" plates with an eyebolt in the middle and 3 holes which I drive 10" nails thru at an angle. I have never actually tested to see how hard it is to pull them out but now I'm thinking it is more important than I thought. I know a picture would be nice but like I said they are in the plane.

  2. #2
    Gilbert Pierce's Avatar
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    I used Fly-Ties http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalo...es/flyties.php. My ropes never loosened. Two airplanes behind me broke their tie-downs and went over on their backs. I know one of them was using the Claw which broke. Several of the Vendor Aircraft broke their claw tie-downs however the winds in the Antique/Classic area were straight line estimated by the NWS to be 75 mph. The Vendor and Homebuilt area were in the area where an F1 Tornado was spawned by the microburst and touched down. Those winds were estimated at 105 mph. I saw Claws in that area broken and others that pulled the nails up.

    Aviation Consumer tested tiedowns and pulled them all up at about 1200 lbs. A 75 knot wind over a short wing will exceed that I believe. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Loq1olceSIE The wind on my airplane was hitting it from side and not head-on.

    Look at this video. http://www.stormforcetiedowns.com/Wh...FYhM2god4T14DA

    Personally after what I saw at SnF I think the Fly-Ties are superior to the Claw. The Storm Force Tiedown certainly is impressive but I did not see anyone using them at SnF.
    Last edited by Gilbert Pierce; 04-12-2011 at 07:56 PM.

  3. #3
    nd_rice's Avatar
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    The big blow at SnF has made me curious too. I watched the Fly-tie then Stormforce videos. In the Fly-tie video we are instructed to tie straight down and in the Stormforce video they do 45 angles. So what is supposed to hold better 90 degree angle or 45 degrees? I have heard reasons for tieing down at an 45 but no reasons for straight down other than less of a tripping hazard.

    If the Stormforce are as strong as they say they are why don't I just go out and buy a length on angle iron, cut it into 3 pieces drill some holes in it and use some landscaping nails and an eye bolt for a homemade version. Am I stating the obvious or infringing on some kind of patent?

  4. #4
    Throttle Pusher's Avatar
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    I use a length of rebar with a thick washer welded to the end. Its not the lightest or the easyest to get out, but it definitly wont come out when you dont wont then to.

  5. #5
    Gilbert Pierce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nd_rice View Post
    If the Stormforce are as strong as they say they are why don't I just go out and buy a length on angle iron, cut it into 3 pieces drill some holes in it and use some landscaping nails and an eye bolt for a homemade version. Am I stating the obvious or infringing on some kind of patent?
    I had the same thought after watching the video. I don't think you would be guilty of a patent infringement as long as you made it for only your own use and not to sell.

    Peter Lubig was tied down behind me with 2 sets of tiedowns on each wing. I think I may cut up some angle iron and get some long nails and use them in conjunction with the fly-ties. Every time I have gone to Sun 'N Fun or OSH I have wondered about the consequences of a tornado. Now I know.

  6. #6
    ysifly2's Avatar
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    on a related note... what tie down supports does anyone have on the struts or at the strut / wing mount?

    My Pacer does not have any provisions for tie down. I have seen some which seem to be a bracket interface using the front strut mount and thru bolt. I have also seen a strap mount that wraps around the strut, near the top, with a "eye loop" down.

    What would be the best installation and source?

    Thanks
    Bryan

  7. #7
    rocket's Avatar
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    Brian,
    When stripping a pacer wing a couple of years ago I found a tie down loop taped to the main spar outboard of the strut attach point. Nice looking old school D ring and bracket that had been there for some time. Perhaps some one here knows something about it?

    My tripacer had the strut brackets fail between the lift strut ant the spar during a + 147 mph blow out in western Alaska.

    I purchased a set of FA Dodge "hurricane" tie down brackets after the fact but never installed them. http://www.fadodge.com/Piper%20Wing%20Items.html

    I did not install the tie down loops and just wrap a rope around my lift strut twice and tie off accordingly. It blew about 70mph a week ago and I was only worried about the ice screws melting out...it was a looooong night.

    Rocket
    Last edited by rocket; 04-12-2011 at 10:26 PM. Reason: fa dodge link

  8. #8

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    Rocket; Sounds like the original Pacer tie-down fitting. The '51 Pacer near me that has the original cotton fabric on it still has inspection covers located over one each side in the usual manner, straddling the front spar and allowing you to swing down the d-ring and attach a tie-down then re-stowing the d-ring out of sight, out of mind. These were PAC p/n 12596-00 and Univair had them illustrated in their catalog for YEARS after they sold the last one they had...No stock for AT LEAST twenty years! Now they are no longer shown, for the last few catalogs.

    I see double-bagging your strut at the upper end with a rope as having the same strength as using the bolted on hook that sticks down through the upper strut fairing...all of which would still probably fail in 147 winds. Boy, THAT's "extreme" and fortunately pretty rare! 'Bout the only thing truly "safe" you could do knowing those kind of winds are comin' is to keep yer Bird in an underground bunker, eh?

    The PA-22s used these "secret" tie-down fitting as well, up to s/n 22-806. I tried to "collect them" starting about 25 years ago and never had any actual luck in doing so... haven't laid eyes on a set for one awful long time. I'm thinking Piper discontinued using these as the bracket wrapped around the spar and it was bolted THROUGH the spar web with two 3/16" bolts (just like the fuel tank straps attach). I think y'all might agree after a coupla seconds of chin-scratchin' that I guess I'd think that adding the outside tie-down loop at the upper strut attach bolt offered quite a bit more structural integrity to the tie-down fitting, and didn't weaken the spar web in doing so. I'd also have to somewhat expect there was something not too cool about the condition of the spar attach fittings...I'd think the wings would fold up before those failed! Wow. Never heard of a failure there unless the fittings were about rusted through (and hence the S.B. that never became an A.D.).

  9. #9
    PeterL's Avatar
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    After watching the video's, I'm going to start double tie downing.

    As you may know ( or not) a friend and I flew my Pacer down and survived the destruction by sheer luck!!!!!!

    Sheer luck from the fact that it was a combo of the following:

    Location, location, location, (sound familiar?)
    -parked on the leeside of very tall trees that helped break the winds.

    Luck
    - that no planes or any flying "anything" hit my plane.

    Lazy
    - I was lazy in the fact that I ended up with two tie downs on each wing and the tail. Why lazy you ask???
    Well, I flew down with the one set that was the auger type, fully knowing that as soon as l landed in KLAL that I would go VFR direct to the CLAW booth and purchase a set, since everyone I know has one, therefore has to be good.................was I wrong. I saw a field full of broken CLAWS (started to look like half price crab leg dinner at a chinese restaurant, CLAWS knee deep ;-D), they break at the center point of one legs, and then the crying starts.
    After returning to the Pacer to tiedwn with the CLAW in addition to the auger that I already was using, I was too lazy to remove the auger and left it in the grd. Therefore double tie down. That helped alot.

    Peter Lubig

  10. #10
    Nathan Hiebert's Avatar
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    I've said it before, laziness will eventually pay off! Glad to hear you made out alright.

    Nate

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