PA-18 Tail Feathers on Pacer

[highroad]

I have noticed that I am running out of elevator when doing outside loops..............er I mean when landing with my new wing mods. I am flying short final slower and am wondering if the 18 horizontal/elevator would do some good. Before the squared off sullivan tips, I did not notice a need for more elevator authority.

What are the differences between the 18 and Pacer tails?
What is involved in the install.

Any opinions?

Thanks,
Brent

[stevesaircraft(Bri)]

Brent,

Buy the STC. Buy the cub tail feathers. Bolt them on.....Tail wires, bolts and everything else remains the same. Cub feathers are about 6 to 8 inches longer than the stock Pacer.

Brian.

[cammons3]

What are the differences between the 18 and Pacer tails?
Brent,
There's a thread archived on here somewhere, if I recall. If I remember correctly, Stephen experimented with this mod (along with others) and didn't find too much improvement. Don't take that as a quote as my CRS disease does have an effect at times... :confused:
Maybe Stephen will chime-in...

[skydogk]

The PA-18 tailfeathers is a really simple mod. Like most things, when you modify one aspect, you discover that other portions need modified as well. I have a crosswind STOL and know that 18 feathers would do me good. I know that Batpacer has them on his too. Stephan just changed his tail over as well. I believe he liked the results.

Just buy the PA-18 horizontal stab, elevators, and rudder. Cover them with your favorite fabric system, and install them the exact same way your removed your original Pacer feathers. It's that simple.

Steve would chime in here, but according to our conversation at the AK Airmens Show, he's having too much fun up here in the 49th State. Really, he has soo much to take in and not nearly enough time to do it.

Skydogk

[highroad]

Thanks for the info guys,

We need to get Stephen's input. I think Brian has told me they had them on their pacer and took them off. If I remember correctly, Stephen put them on, but was not sold last I talked to them.

So the span is a little larger. What about the cord of the elevator? Why do you have to do the rudder as well? Is it larger?

Thanks

[Throttle Pusher]

I have the X-Wind tips on my airplane as well,with the same problem.
I found that on final I would trim the airplane so I would have a little foward pressure
on the yoke, and this would give me more elevator on touch down. When I've got someone in the
back or loaded with camping gear where I have more of a aft CG I dont have the problem.
It would however be nice to correct this problem. Do you have VG's on your tail feathers that
helps as well.
Ken

[highroad]

Ken,
Good idea on the trim......I trim nose down a lot for take off to get the tail up if I need to be able to see/manuver on my takeoff roll. I am also leary of giving a lot of nose up trim on final incase I have to go around. Full power and full flaps sends me quickly cranking the nose down with the trim and getting a notch of flaps off to keep the nose down.

But I may try trimming it some more if I am commited and not going around.

Brent

[Throttle Pusher]

Be carefull, remember I have a nose pusher, trim for go around works well with the nose trim alittle up.
It could cause problems that I'm not aware of for the tail dragers.
Ken

[BatPacer]

PA-18 tail feathers do make sense for some.. I would submit that if you run out of elevator on landing and cannot touch tail first then a.) check your rigging and b.) consider the larger tail surfaces. If you are also looking for a little more rotational authority (e.g. float flying) then also consider them. I suppose a third reason (but related to the first) is in the case of either the cuffed wing or the slotted wing which are mods that require you fly the plane at relatively high AOA which the larger tail surfaces facilitate. As I've said before, if you need new tail feathers for some other reason (damage, corrosion, etc.), then why not? It's a decent chunk of change to spend otherwise.
Paul

[Todd]

It looks like my earlier posted photo comparison is no longer available - here's the photo that shows my old -22 frames on top of new -18 covered horizontal and elevator. Haven't flown it yet....

[JoeB]

It looks like my earlier posted photo comparison is no longer available - here's the photo that shows my old -22 frames on top of new -18 covered horizontal and elevator. Haven't flown it yet....

hmm, only took a quick look at that photo but I'm seeing more elevator on the PA20/22 than on the PA18! I'd say that the sq ft of the horizontal stabilizer is greater on the -18 but not the elevator, does anyone else see this or am I getting tired?

(look at the PA20/22 outer 'triangle' on the elevator as compared to the much smaller one on the -18)

[highroad]

Spoke with Dakota Cub NW (Yakima Aerosports) and they sell new PA-18 horizontal for just under $350 and the elevator for $350.

Put an e-mail into Vera at Cub Crafters to see if they sell them as well.

[nicka]

Atlee dodge also sell flight controls