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Thread: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

  1. #1
    walt.buskey's Avatar
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    Default PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Anybody have a pic of what the baffle seal(s) on this looks like? Mine had nothing left of the old material except the staples. There was very obviously a baffle seal on the bottom, but also perhaps one on the top?? (There are what appear to be staple holes in the upper edge.) This is a small baffle that's mounted between the nose wheel frame tubes.

    Sorry, this is the best pic I have at the moment of the baffle in question, and not sure if the name I'm calling it is correct....

    Gettin' ever closer!

    Walt

    DSC07317 copy.jpg

  2. #2
    FFSchooley's Avatar
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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Part 13136. Univair sells it. Sorry it’s not the best pic. My scoop has a rubber “westherseal” edge that is stapled to the scoop. You might be missing that. Others might chime in that know better.

    9E5CE37F-015C-4591-A47B-0C6C4078ECBD.jpg
    Last edited by FFSchooley; 05-10-2020 at 10:41 PM.

  3. #3
    walt.buskey's Avatar
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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Yes, that's definitely it... all I have left is the metal part, which has what looks like staple holes along the bottom and the top, with the cut-out for the carb air filter inlet. I'll get a better pic soon. Was wondering just what the pattern of seal material looked like --and what was used, but it sounds like it was rubber. Still hoping someone can get me a pic of their PA-22's piece.

    The Univair pic helps, thanks. (Can't say that I want to spend $200 @ Univair to find out just how it's made, however....)

  4. #4
    walt.buskey's Avatar
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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Well, I never think to look in my parts book... And there it is, #9 in the drawing, Piper part #13136-000, "Baffle assembly, engine bottom." Almost looks like garage-door "P" strip stuff....

    DSC08491.jpg

    So -- anybody have a pic of that piece in their T-P?
    Last edited by walt.buskey; 05-11-2020 at 07:39 AM.

  5. #5

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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Mine has a piece of 1/2" thick X 1" by approx 24" felt stapled to metal on the lower portion & two shorter pieces on upper portion either side of carb box. Might call fabric store, Upholstery shop or Univair for the FELT. I used a piece from a Stinson baffle to replace, same size as Piper. I drilled 1/8 new hole in staple hole & used pop rivets to install.

  6. #6

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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Quote Originally Posted by walt.buskey View Post
    Yes, that's definitely it... all I have left is the metal part, which has what looks like staple holes along the bottom and the top, with the cut-out for the carb air filter inlet. I'll get a better pic soon. Was wondering just what the pattern of seal material looked like --and what was used, but it sounds like it was rubber. Still hoping someone can get me a pic of their PA-22's piece.

    The Univair pic helps, thanks. (Can't say that I want to spend $200 @ Univair to find out just how it's made, however....)

    I bought the new Univair part. Someone had replaced the felt on my original with the rubber type baffle seal material and it was cutting into the lower aluminum cowling. I didn't like that and had no idea how long it had been on there, but it had cut through the enamel and was wearing a groove, so I bought the new one. It had a different seal material. I'd describe it as foam rubber with a thin rubber coated nylon outer sheath. It's not very durable however and it is beginning to chafe after maybe 15 hours. On the other hand it is softer than baffle material and won't wear into the cowl anymore. The material is sort of like my Zulu 2 ear-cup pads, but more dense. Here's a couple unintentional pics I happened to have of part of the Univair chin scoop from a couple angles.
    IMG_3519[1].JPGIMG_3535[1].JPG It didn't seal closely to the air cleaner cut out and we ended up gluing a small piece of baffle rubber to the bottom of the cutout on the scoop to seal it better. Knowing what I know now, I'd have modified my existing scoop to use softer material of some sort, maybe original type felt. Only down side I see to felt is that it will soak up oil, which can lead to fires. The Univair seal material may be available in bulk somewhere. Hope this helps.

  7. #7
    walt.buskey's Avatar
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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Yes, that does help, and many thanks for the "inadvertent" pics (I have a lot of those, too)!

    I also discovered another thread on the same topic by Todd Loes from back in 2015, in the Maintenance Hangar section. Same deal. He found that Univair does sell that NX502B-52 rubber moulding by the foot, even though it doesn't show up on their website. At least it was apparently available in 2015. I'll inquire, and have posted a question for Todd on that thread as well.

    I've also used felt, some 3/8" and some 1/2", in other places, since the front left baffle I did buy from $nivair--while crying a bit-- came with felt. (see pic below; you can also see my mod for the alternator conversion & subsequent install of the flexible oil cooler line...)

    Looking in my parts book, it appears Piper used a lot of felt all over, though I also wondered about moisture, fuel & oil soaking into it over time.


    DSC08320.jpg

  8. #8
    Glen Geller's Avatar
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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    On the original it was round rubber that was compressed against the cowling. I didn't have any of that stuff, but I did have something just as functional.
    On my 55 PA22-150, I made a completely new part by snipping two aluminum skins like the ratty original, and sandwiched 2" or 3" wide baffle silicone top and bottom, and used pop rivets approximately where the stables go, maybe 6-8 along top and bottom.
    Cut a notch in the upper seal where it goes around the carb air box, for a zero-clearance fit.
    Trim as needed to fit around stuff and make a good contact with the lower cowling.
    It's not rocket science, you're just trying to keep most of the inlet air from escaping that area.
    We ended up making a couple more for some of the other Tri-Pacers in our club.

    The real bugger is finding and installing the Air Inlet Scoop, especially if you have the Brackett Air Filter.
    I hate that thing. Just a few goofy parts riveted together but a real PITA. We bought several NOS and all were a little different, two needed to be un-riveted because the side panels were attached to the wrong side of the mating tabs and would not fit on the plane.
    It's shown on the CD "engine installation" and you really need to use your imagination.
    https://www.shortwingpipers.org/foru...ht=inlet+scoop

    Cheers,
    GG
    Glen Geller
    1955 PA22-150 "One For Papa!"

  9. #9
    walt.buskey's Avatar
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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Great, Glen.... now another thing I'm missing!

    Seriously, thanks for the heads up -- I just finished reading (studying, really) that old post from 2010 ... that continues into 2019.... Nope, it doesn't look like I have THAT, either. Man, Univair's gonna love me.

    Here's a recent pic from the side of my carb.... nope, no extra air scoop thingy in there...

    DSC08332.jpg

    And thanks for the tip about making that baffle seal around the air dam!

    Walt

  10. #10

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    Default Re: PA-22 Chin scoop baffle seal

    Quote Originally Posted by walt.buskey View Post
    Great, Glen.... now another thing I'm missing!

    Seriously, thanks for the heads up -- I just finished reading (studying, really) that old post from 2010 ... that continues into 2019.... Nope, it doesn't look like I have THAT, either. Man, Univair's gonna love me.

    Here's a recent pic from the side of my carb.... nope, no extra air scoop thingy in there...

    DSC08332.jpg

    And thanks for the tip about making that baffle seal around the air dam!

    Walt
    I bought one of those Univair Air Inlet Scoops 13137-00, thinking I too was missing that part. I started in to modify the rivets as suggested by Glen before I even removed my Brackett housing to see how much clearance I needed. I found it didn't need to be modified to clear the sides of the filter housing I so only redid one of the rivets. Thought I had it skinned out. The bummer for me was putting it all back together and seeing how far off the alignment was for the leather seal to my front strut. Like 3/8" or more off center. I don't know why unless my strut structural support is bent, or perhaps it's only used on some earlier serial number planes? I've studied the strut support structure and IA and A&P's have looked at it and said it's all straight. So I have a new $180.00 scoop that sits on my bench unused. Anyway, if you want one, I'll make you a good deal on it. PM me if so.
    Last edited by Subsonic; 05-12-2020 at 03:41 PM.

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