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Thread: OK City isn't OK

  1. #1

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    Default OK City isn't OK

    8 Months into trying to renew the registration on an expired PA-17. Previous owner had reported to the FAA that the plane was disassembled and didn't pay the fee. He passed away while the FAA was sending the warning letter that it was about to expire. I got a bill of sale from a family member.
    FAA acts like disassembled means cut into small pieces and doesn't want to renew it. I have sent pics of the plane at the FAA's request. The latest letter states that "Piper is questioning the data plate as well".....I am requested to send more info to see if it "matches Pipers records"
    Part of request is Left and Right wing serial numbers. I didn't know there was such a thing, or where to look.
    I question if Piper has any of these records. I have been led to believe they were retrieved from a dumpster by a private party.
    Any advice, similar experience appreciated.

  2. #2

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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    Contact the nearest FSDO and explain your situation.
    Maybe one of them will come out and inspect the airplane in question and verify for OK City exactly what you have.
    Worth a phone call.

    Good luck,

    Rick

  3. #3
    Administrator Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    I have not seen the serial numbers on wings but seen dates written in grease pencil. Contact Clyde Smith the Cub Doctor and he can give you the numbers the airplane left Piper with.

  4. #4

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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    Piper today isn’t the same company it was when that airplane was built. The people working there aren’t going to know any more about it than the FAA. Someone else went through this not long ago and the FAA and Piper claimed the data plate was bad because there was no date of manufacture on it even though no one could find a data plate that had a date on it.

    The build sheet for my L4 has wing serial numbers on it but I have seen it posted elsewhere the numbers were just grease penciled on. They likely disappeared the first time it got new fabric. I am pretty sure at least one of my wings has been replaced anyway.

  5. #5
    Administrator Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    Piper has the same records Clyde has.

  6. #6

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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Pierce View Post
    Piper has the same records Clyde has.
    True but not the working knowledge of what was done. David’s story about the Clipper he was trying to register reveals a lot about the problems to overcome, including dealing with Piper.

    https://www.shortwingpipers.org/forum/showthread.php?12773-PA-16-Data-Plate-Pictures&highlight=Clipper

  7. #7
    Administrator Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    What I am saying is that they have the same numbers Clyde has. They are checking boxes. Show them the frame number etc and their boxes are checked as are those of the FAA.

  8. #8

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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    I have a similar issue with my PA-16. It seems that the Registration branch is going by the strict definition of aircraft” means any contrivance invented, used, or designed to navigate, or fly in, the air. as it shows in 49 USC 40102. Their take is that it has to be a complete machine ready to take to the air in order to register it. While I don't agree, that is what they have been saying for the last couple years.

    In my case, the previous owner fought it for the better part of 2 years. When I got the project, I submitted my application and they refused to process it (never did give me a denial). I got my Congressmen and Senators involved, and it went all the way to Rick Domingo, Executive Director of Flight Standards. I have a letter from him that states once I supply photos of the completed aircraft, a registration certificate will be issued. All this took over 2 1/2 years to get along with multiple visits from both FSDO Inspectors and MIDO Inspectors. All in all, I'd bet that this simple registration will have cost the taxpayers a couple thousand dollars for the FAA time to process it. Such a waste!
    Letter 2 from Rick Domingo FAA_Page_1.jpg
    Last edited by dgapilot; 05-03-2021 at 09:12 AM.

  9. #9

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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    Oh, yeah, there were no serial numbers or dates on my wings. If you want more info on how I got to where I am, send me a PM, I'm glad to help.

  10. #10
    Administrator Steve Pierce's Avatar
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    Default Re: OK City isn't OK

    Quote Originally Posted by FarmerJoe View Post
    8 Months into trying to renew the registration on an expired PA-17. Previous owner had reported to the FAA that the plane was disassembled and didn't pay the fee. He passed away while the FAA was sending the warning letter that it was about to expire. I got a bill of sale from a family member.
    FAA acts like disassembled means cut into small pieces and doesn't want to renew it. I have sent pics of the plane at the FAA's request. The latest letter states that "Piper is questioning the data plate as well".....I am requested to send more info to see if it "matches Pipers records"
    Part of request is Left and Right wing serial numbers. I didn't know there was such a thing, or where to look.
    I question if Piper has any of these records. I have been led to believe they were retrieved from a dumpster by a private party.
    Any advice, similar experience appreciated.
    I would contact Clyde, get the numbers, provide them to the FAA and they can check their boxes.

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