Cleaning dirty poly fibre cloth

Y

York614

Non-Member
South Dakota
Have had my PA22/20 in storage in my barn for 14 years, finally getting to restoration to flight. Purchased at auction, 2 new wings came with as old ones had failed punch test. New ones covered in polyfibre, unpainted (raw fabric, no topcoat or primer). They’re very dirty. Before proceeding with applying topcoat, I know they’ll need to be cleaned. So what can one safely clean the untreated fabric with? I understand that polyfibre has been STC’d to only allow their topcoats, too?
any help appreciated.
 
Welcome to the ShortWing community.
How long has it been exposed to light? UV will deteriorate polyfiber over time if it is not protected. If you are going to use the Polyfiber coating process, Polyfiber recommends wiping fabric down with MEK as their coatings are MEK based. If the wings are really coated with dirt I would probably wash the down with kitchen dish detergent Dawn, rinse really well and then wipe them down with MEK..
 
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Light exposure was absolutely minimum; spent their sabbatical at the back of the barn, well away from the door. And they are very dirty, due in large part to that lovely haboob (1930’s style dust storm) we had last year, which got dirt into every corner of the barn. Hoping to never see one of those again in this lifetime.
she has been moved to a hangar to begin restoration, but a serious cleaning will be the first step. I have heard that yo7 can use Imron over the polyfiber coating to get a gloss finish, as the polyfiber coating is semigloss at best (?).
 
Hi,

Polyfiber also has a gloss finish system available for their fabrics.
 
My Clipper had been painted with Imron when I bought it. Bought cheap because of the ringworm and cracks in the paint
There are many high gloss fabric paints available. Airtech, Ranthane, Aerothane, Superflight, Stewart’s. Ranthane is Polyfiber’s high gloss top coat.
I used Airtech over Polyfiber and Airtech complete system because like Stewarts it does not use MEK which stinks.
 
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Gilbert Pierce said:
My Clipper had been painted with Imron when I bought it. Bought cheap because of the ringworm and cracks in the paint
There are many high gloss fabric paints available. Airtech, Ranthane, Aerothane, Superflight, Stewart’s. Ranthane is Polyfiber’s high gloss top coat.
I used Airtech over Polyfiber and Airtech complete system because like Stewarts it does not use MEK which stinks.
Click to expand...
Thank you for answering. Just getting into this, excited to get going, but have a lot to learn.
 
Thank you for the answer. Will look into which coatings can give a nice gloss. Is there one vendor better to deal withthan another?
 
After you clean the wings you can also paint them with Stewart paint. Their paint is highly glossy and can be used over poly fiber fabric system. If you do, make sure to follow their process and first seal the (cleaned) fabric with thinned down Eco Glue (Stewart’s) glue, then their Eco Fill (UV protection) primer and top coat.

Juergen
Pacer N3342Z
 
Hello,

Our TriPacer had set awhile. The previous owner found mud dauber nests and a small amount of corrosion in the wings and decided to recover them. When we pulled the headliner out we found several old mud dauber nests—practically a condo association!!

I would think the best thing to do would be remove the fabric and inspect the wings. If the wings have gotten some kind of oil, grease etc on them—washing the fabric may not be enough to give you a good lasting finish. JMHO

~~Marsha (and Ron and Daisy-N2709P)
 
You should have enough inspection holes in the wings to be able to do a good inspection without cutting the fabric. Maybe use a borescope to look deeper into it. You can then decide if a recover is needed depending on what you see.

Juergen
Pacer N3342Z
 
Good to know. Hate mud daubers; mud daubers, wasps, yellow-jackets, hornets…
bumble bees are generally harmless, and honey bees are beneficial, but I wouldn’t want even them nesting inside my wings!
 
The inspection holes are there, but not even cut yet. That’ll be the first step. The covers are in the old wings, along with all the flaps, tanks, ailerons, lights and wiring…
I have a borescope, but it’s a cheap one; might invest in a better one just for this.
 
The fabric is probably the cheapest part of a recover. Your going to have to be very thorough in cleaning to ensure proper adhesion of the coatings. My opinion would be to just strip them to give a proper inspection and put an extra coat of varnish on the bows (seeming as they’re already how old?). Then spend the $300 and apply fresh rag.

Polyfiber changed their STC to only allow their topcoats because they where getting so many complaints on ringworm caused by people using topcoats that lacked the proper flex agents. Polytone, Aerothane, and Ranthane are the approved topcoats. Aerothane and Ranthane are a urethane based high gloss paint. Attached photo is a wing done in Aerothane.
5d9b0c44f30579a18ad931e8479f4f70.jpg
 
I am in the camp of removing the fabric, cleaning inspecting and varnishing. I have a brand new set of Cub wings that I bought from Univair 15 years ago that have been in inside storage. Amazing the deterioration that has occurred during this time. I will have to completely disassemble the wings and start over. Retirement job. The contamination on the fabric on your wings will be very difficult to completely ensure that it is removed. Just engine exhaust over the years will cause contamination. Is it really worth the potential to have paint issues in the future? I am also not a fan of tops coats that are not compatible dope. Repairing fabric that has dope only is a no-brainer. Chemically, dope bonds to itself and you do not have to spend hours removing a non-dope top coat down to bare fabric. These airplane did not originally have a bright and shiny finish. The fabric was a bit duller than the enamel or lacquer metal finishes. If you want a shiny finish, get out the wax. That goes for the Stewart finishes also. They do not chemically bond with other finishes. They use a mechanical bond which means sanding or roughing up the finish prior to application. I have just done some refinishing of a boot cowl painted with Stewart and I was able to peel it off in large sheets. I would hate to see how it performs on the bottom of the wing at the root in the propeller blast. Look at all the cars you see with peeling water based paint. It did not work when it was Blue River or whatever it was previously called and I don’t think that it works that well now. By the way, if you spray dope as the final finish, you use the same respirator as for Stewart’s. Of course, I still prefer the finish that you got with Grade A. Other a than lack of longevity if left outside, dope and cotton recovering left a much nicer and more durable finish. Dope is absorbed into the cotton fiber like a dye while dope has to encircle the fibers in Dacron. If that first coat of dope is not applied properly to Dacron (you cannot spray the first coat, it must be brushed), the finish will never hold up. The only time that I saw ringworm with a cotton and dope finish was when a top coat other than dope was used. Old skool.
Just another opinion.
N2709P
 
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I’ve seen plenty of ringworm on dope finishes, polytone, urethane, etc. Everything will eventually have the plasticizers migrate out of it and start cracking. It’s just a matter of how long and that can be lengthened with proper care.
As for adhesion, a properly prepped base will prevent a topcoat from sloughing off. 99% of paint is prep work.
Repairs to urethane aren’t that much more difficult than colored butyrate or polytone. You just remove the coatings by working on the backside of the fabric. I’ll do a thread on it next time I do a repair.
 
As I said, just another opinion. 90% of the ringworm issues that I have seen in my 53 years as an A&P have been due to a topcoat that was not truly compatible with the dope base. It was common practice in the day to spray a coat of enamel to “help” the punch test. This pretty much guaranteed ringworm in a few years. The few dope coat ringworm issues were cleaned up with rejuvenator and another coat of colored dope was then applied. Repairing a top coat other than dope, again in my opinion, is a giant PITA. It sounds great in theory but getting to the backside of a repair is close to impossible in 90% of repairs. A customer really has a hard time paying for me to disassemble his aircraft to get to the backside of the repair, spend two days prepping the repair and another two days reapplying the finish. Then you get to wet sand to blend. All for a small rock tear on the belly or elevator. And yes, it is all about adhesion. And that starts with the base coat. Mess that up and the rest of the coats are along for the ride. A old friend whom has been an Oshkosh judge for many years in the vintage class tells me that they are deducting points for the poly type finishes. No deduction for Dacron but extra points for grade A or linen. The aircraft are being over restored. The warbird crowd is slowly following suit.
N2709P
 
I am completely new to this. Everything inside the wings is aluminum. Can you explain the “varnishing” part?
 
Imrons claim to fame is its hardness, it was very tough, but not flexible, and definitely not something you'd want to use on an stc'd cover system.
Stuart's just sux.... period. The technique required to get a good finish is positively mental, and you'll need to be committed if your working towards a run and sag free finish... if your worried about chemicals, pay someone to do it for you.
Aero Thane is the way to go, it was reformulated from the ground up in the early 2000's with flexibility as the main characteristic, it shoots like butter and if you wet sand between the first and second coats it looks amazing. Superflight and airtech are the only other urethanes id consider, ranthane likes to run like an untrained dog.

Dawn is a fantastic cleaner if you can use hot hot water... the challenge comes with the varnish, if it isn't a quality varnish job you've just soaked your wood with water.... no bueno.

Strip it. Sand it. Use a two part varnish. Recover it with polyfiber, it's probably the most reasonably priced system out there and performs right up there after all these years.

If budget is elastic, cover with oratex and shoot a top coat of aerothane.

Good luck.
 
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