Non-short wing question about parachute operations

Tnathan

MEMBER
So, thought I would ask this here since I talk to you folks the most and trust your experience. I had a few hours and thought would knock the rust off today at what use to be a sleepy little airport I was originally based at. In the last year a group of vagabonds have set up a jumping operation using a 182. I generally don’t mind and like seeing anyone make a go of it in aviation.

I was based at a previous field and got along fine with their parachute operations fabulously. I would always let them take off first and land first to go make money. They would act like in air ATC give all the standard jump operations notices plus a lot more: five minutes until jumpers away, jumpers away don’t over fly the field, be on the look out x canopies in the air, jumpers no factor south of your position, jumpers recovered. In addition they would ask where I am to maintain separation, and tell me where the jump plane was. If they needed me to do something they would ask and I would always say sure and comply. I am just there to have fun. Pattern was to the west and they had a field the jumpers landed in just east of the runway. I actually enjoyed flying with them and seeing the canopies. I think they enjoyed having the company rather than flying around all day making radio calls no one responds to. I felt we were watching out for each other and being responsible.

So, back to today with the new tenants. They seem to have the attitude that when they are in operation all aircraft operations must cease. I understand the call “do not overfly the field” to mean don’t overfly the field, don’t cross midfield downwind, etc. I didn’t understand it to mean that all air and ground operations must cease. They have yelled at me for taking off, and landing, and once for taxing on the taxiway past their recovery field with jumpers in the air. I have even tried working with them, but they won’t say anything other than jumpers away followed by a lot of panicked, angry, snarky directives for me to stop. I have asked if they can confirm they are remaining south of the field, or how many canopies are in the air, or have you recovered the jumpers yet. No response.

So, was the way things worked at my old field more seasoned operators or were they being cowboys. Are these new guys doing it by the book or being bad neigbors. As near as I can tell, their attitude is from the time the jumpers leave until they are recovered. No one should taxi and you should stay out of the pattern and away from the field.

I asked my wife she said well don’t over fly the field means that. It doesn’t mean land immediately and shut down until further notice. But, she said it’s up to me to see and avoid. Jumpers have priority and if something happens aside from harm no one want I would be at fault, so be vigilant.

What do you all think? How do you work with jump operations?


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I have seen operations like that at some nearby airports, it can be frustrating.
Is the jump service a commercial operation or a club? they could be operating illegally if they are for hire and not a commercial operation.
If there is no reasoning with them I suggest first you call the AOPA and ask what they recommend.
You can also call the US Parachute Association and ask what you can do to peacefully, safely coexist with these folk. https://uspa.org/
Contact the agency that owns the field and ask them to join you on a flight or monitor from the ground to see what's going on, and intervene if needed.
You could call your FSDO and present it as a hypothetical (no mention of the airport name/location) and see if they have suggestions.


Best of luck and keep safe,
GG
 
Glen,

Thanks. I was wondering if what I was used to was normal or not. I want to be a good citizen, but It seems like these guys kind of like to be mean until folks stop treading on their turf. This airport is out in the middle of nowhere but it’s public and the state had repaved the runway a few years back. It’s a place a lot of folks go to to practice.

As for their operation, I don’t know how commercial they are. To my eyes, they look like the typical shoestring operation I often see around here. Just trying to make enough money to sustain their lifestyle living out of an rv.

There was another field south of here with a jump operation. They have a grass field so I thought it would be fun to go there and check things out a while back. They too griped at me on the radio for landing while they had “jumpers away.” I taxied to the ramp and parked in a spot painted with The typical T parking indicator. As soon as I got out they had a PA system and told me I can’t park there. The jump plane pilot came rushing over and said he would help me push back out of the way. Apparently despite the markings, they use the ramp to turn around after picking up their load. I went to the fbo, it was closed. I went to the jump school, and was told despite being listed as having fuel, none was available to the public. And, no one cared to talk to me. So, I left. The place was filled with what looked like hippies with like 20 RVs in various states of disrepair. I was a little disappointed. Hoping I was going to meet some fellow grassroots aviators, but given the reception maybe I don’t want to know what goes on there. I decided I should take the hint and get while the getting was good. The movie point break kept running through my head. Oh well.


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Glen,

Thanks. I was wondering if what I was used to was normal or not. I want to be a good citizen, but It seems like these guys kind of like to be mean until folks stop treading on their turf. This airport is out in the middle of nowhere but it’s public and the state had repaved the runway a few years back. It’s a place a lot of folks go to to practice.

As for their operation, I don’t know how commercial they are. To my eyes, they look like the typical shoestring operation I often see around here. Just trying to make enough money to sustain their lifestyle living out of an rv.

There was another field south of here with a jump operation. They have a grass field so I thought it would be fun to go there and check things out a while back. They too griped at me on the radio for landing while they had “jumpers away.” I taxied to the ramp and parked in a spot painted with The typical T parking indicator. As soon as I got out they had a PA system and told me I can’t park there. The jump plane pilot came rushing over and said he would help me push back out of the way. Apparently despite the markings, they use the ramp to turn around after picking up their load. I went to the fbo, it was closed. I went to the jump school, and was told despite being listed as having fuel, none was available to the public. And, no one cared to talk to me. So, I left. The place was filled with what looked like hippies with like 20 RVs in various states of disrepair. I was a little disappointed. Hoping I was going to meet some fellow grassroots aviators, but given the reception maybe I don’t want to know what goes on there. I decided I should take the hint and get while the getting was good. The movie point break kept running through my head. Oh well.


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Oh and another thing just looked them up on uspa. They are listed and have a webpage link. So, they seem to be a real thing. Interestingly the other place I had visited once isn’t listed. I wonder if these guys are the same folks and they relocated bringing their hospitality with them.


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Nathan,I don't have a lot of experience but I did do a bunch of static line jumps over a few weekends out of Hollister California as a young man.


Later I flew sailplanes out of a place near Ralli-Durham North Carolina, I think it was called Sky Sailing, that was a major jump base. Not so much hippy but clean cut thrill seekers and a full on party after the birds were put away. Best hangover of my life came from one of those shindigs. The guy that owned the place had a love for sailplanes but the jumpers paid the bills.


Seems like best you could do is to stop fighting them, get the supplement to pull the back door off your bird and give a few rides to the jumpers, show up mid week and see if any of those hippies would like a free ride so you could learn about flying jumpers. Something like that. And thinking you could actually learn a little more about their needs and why they act the way they do?


Hung out with some smoke jumpers when I was doing heavy maintenance at Tramco on Pain field. These guys were some serious mad doing **** jobs in the city craving fire season. Handy friends when it got rough in the bar with laid off loggers...


There is this guy that comes up to Alaska every summer so he can sky dive off a float plane. Don Lee up here at Alaska Floats and Skis takes him up and he crawls out onto a pontoon and then jumps from there!


I see a lot of me me and mine in the different aspects of aviation and it makes me sad, we have to find ways to get along and support each other or we all loose. I get it that it's different down there in America without the space we have up here but the problems are the same: noise, tie down space, flying too low... ****, if had a dollar each time some moron blasted my hanger door, or open hanger door, or the hot shot beaver pilot who decided to spin her around on wheels inside my hanger... And don't get me started on helo opps...


One big happy family.




Rocket
 
I think I would look up the regulations for a start and then work from there. We have hunters get upset with us operating off of gravel bars during hunting season. I am good at appeasing them and trying to get along but from time to time I have to quote the law as well. I try to get along with them because one person can make it really bad and most of the time just visiting with them and discussing things has worked out for me.
 
Harvey Field north of Seattle has a regular jumping operation going and they have a lot of aircraft based. I have flown in many times when jumping operations are going on. The jumpers land on the airport just off the runway. We all seem to coexist just fine. Sometimes we have to hold off landings and departures when the jumpers are landing. But, it no big deal.
 
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